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Adding Different Materials
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* December 27, 2014, 07:50:46 PM
I am trying to rebuild parts for TC21

In the attached, I am trying to add windows to the their frame as I did in the past.

Now, when I add the windows to the frame, the entire frame becomes a window.

How can I avoid this behavior?

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* December 27, 2014, 09:16:58 PM
#1
In Options>Preferences, there's an option lableled, "Transfer material from operand on its facet." If that is enabled in your installation, try DISabling it; if it's disabled, ENable it. The TCad Genie is confused about what this means in v21.

Henry H

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* December 28, 2014, 06:23:34 AM
#2
Henry,

I had tried that. For me, I get the same result either way.

J

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* December 28, 2014, 08:25:40 AM
#3
Henry,

I had tried that. For me, I get the same result either way.

J

Yeah, so do I. I think the problem is that the windows fit so well that when they're added to the other object, the result is perfectly seamless and Genie has no way to distinguish the windows from the frame. Two workarounds come to mind, both of which do work for me in your drawing:

1) Rescale the windows by some small factor before adding -- I used 1.001 in the X, Y, and Z directions.

2) Group the objects instead of adding.

Henry H

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December 28, 2014, 11:03:52 AM
#4
I like the idea of making the window-glass and the window-frame separate entities of a Group or a Block.  It makes the most sense to me, as it more accurately reflects the real-world-- two different entities/components within one Object.

_____
However, I might have another suitable workaround:

>Make the window-glass thicker than it needs to be, before the 3D-Add.  Example:  For a window-pane that is to be 48"x60"x½" thick, make it 48"x60"x1" thick (height) for now.
>3D-Add the window-glass and the window-frame.  If Materials are assigned previous to this 3D-Add, the first entity to select in the 3D-Add procedure should be the window-frame, so that the resultant Part takes on the Material assignment of the window-frame.
>Right on-top-of the window-glass, create another 3D-Object that has the same width and length as the window-glass, but any height.  Example (continuing with the example noted above):  48"x60"x10".  Assign the desired Glass Material to that Object.
>Copy that Object to the underside of the window-glass-- facet-to-facet; vertices-to-vertices.  (Just relocate the Reference Point to a vertex, pick-up-and-move, Vertex-Snapping to the window-glass)
>Reposition the first newly-created Object to where it is embedded in the window-glass-- in the "height" direction-- that amount that needs to be removed from that side of the window-glass.  From the example I'm using:  Lower the height of the first 48x60x10 Object ¼".
>Repeat with the Object on the underside of the window-glass.  From the example I'm using:  Raise the height of the second 48x60x10 Object ¼".

>>With "Transfer material from operand..." checked "On" in Options/Preference (or "Off", if it's messed-up/backwards in version-21), 3D-Subtract both of these newly-created Objects from the window-glass-&-frame unit.  The result:  The glass within the window-unit will have the Glass Material which transferred from the Material setting of the two Objects; and the glass in the window-unit will be the desired thickness-- ½" in my example.

Works in version-19-Deluxe (attached).  Might as well try it.
In version-19-Deluxe, the option is worded "Transfer material from operand".  In other versions, the words "on its facet" may be added.  So, I don't know how this works with Solids-- that is... if the transferred Material will be incorporated throughout the volume of the Object.

-Alvin
« Last Edit: December 28, 2014, 01:01:11 PM by Alvin Gregorio »

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Alvin Gregorio
Intermittent TurboCAD user since yr. 2000 (ver6.5).  No formal CAD Training.
---TurboCAD: V21PP; V20.2PP; V19DL; V11.2Pro; Windows-7-Pro/64-bit; Intel-Core-i3 CPU; 2.27ghz; 4GB RAM; Intel HD Graphics (CPU based)


* December 28, 2014, 12:03:20 PM
#5
I am trying to rebuild parts for TC21

In the attached, I am trying to add windows to the their frame as I did in the past.

Now, when I add the windows to the frame, the entire frame becomes a window.

How can I avoid this behavior?

Hey big Jim, I see two solids in your drawing. If you perform Sat healing on each solid then 3d add > it works, must be bad geometry.

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"What do I know, I'm still learning"..
Windows 7 64 bit HP > 2019-2018-2017, TurboCad Platinum 21,20,19 and 18.Using LightWorks, Anilab lab 5.  HP all in one  23" Touch smart screen with Nvidia Geforce 210, open gl 3.3. Intel Core i5 ,2.27GHz,4 GB ram.


* December 28, 2014, 04:23:31 PM
#6
I see that doing SAT healing on just the blue piece makes it work.

To create that piece I:

1. Do a loft (creating something cone-like)
2. Intersect with an extrusion (creating the vertical edge at the bottom)
3. Shell
4. Subtract extrusions to create the openings.

There is nothing precise here that typically creates a bad part.

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* December 28, 2014, 05:06:51 PM
#7
Let me take a step back here. This was working on TC20.

In the attached file, I have a two-frame loft and an extrusion.

1. Shell the loft to -1/32" while removing the top and bottom.
2. Intersect the loft with the extrusion.
3. Drag the windows block (consisting of extrusions) and set its origin to 0,0,0
4. Explode
5. Subtract the windows from the solid.
6. Try SAT healing. I get a bad object.

I am puzzled why this would cause such a problem.


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* December 28, 2014, 07:14:12 PM
#8
Let me add to this another example.

Here is a shape from my file. I do an extrude and it creates all kinds of chaos as you can see in the attached image.

However, if I copy the shape to a new file, it extrudes as one would expect.

That said, I created the file originally by:

1. Selecting all the the 2D objects in a TC20 file.
2. Creating a group.
3. Create a new TC21 file
4. Pasted the group to the TC21 file.

I am mystified as to the process that causes the 3d objects to become caca when I move them to TC21.

EDIT:

Copying to a new file does not fix the problem. The caca is not visible if you enable DEGENERATIVE FACETING.
« Last Edit: December 28, 2014, 07:22:17 PM by bigjimslade »

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* December 28, 2014, 08:02:55 PM
#9
Let me add to this another example.

Here is a shape from my file. I do an extrude and it creates all kinds of chaos as you can see in the attached image.

However, if I copy the shape to a new file, it extrudes as one would expect.

That said, I created the file originally by:

1. Selecting all the the 2D objects in a TC20 file.
2. Creating a group.
3. Create a new TC21 file
4. Pasted the group to the TC21 file.

I am mystified as to the process that causes the 3d objects to become caca when I move them to TC21.

EDIT:

Copying to a new file does not fix the problem. The caca is not visible if you enable DEGENERATIVE FACETING.

I encounter that problem fairly often and I don't know how to prevent it. Sometimes it can be fixed by slicing the object, applying SAT Healing to each piece, then adding the parts back together. That did work for me in your drawing.

Henry H

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* December 28, 2014, 08:35:13 PM
#10
Thanks Henry,

The next problem is chain reactions.

In the first attached image I have the same shape as above extruded and cleaned up by slice/heal/add. That gives a clean line.

However, in the second image I have subtracted it from a solid, and I get a jagged line.

Me thinks this is in need of a bug fix.


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