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Why so blocky?
Read 6061 times
* June 10, 2014, 05:52:31 AM
I'm trying to get to grips with V21.1 Plat x64 Bld 35.5 and am having a hard time.
I've created a simple drawing to try things out, and created two named views to be printed in Hidden Line render. In V16 these come out nice and crisp, like the the side elevation, so why are they so blocky and fuzzy in V21? The attacment shows what I mean.

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Gary Wooding
Win10 64-bit,
TC21.2 x64 Plat, Bld59
TC16.2 Plat, Bld54.0
TCC 3.5


* June 10, 2014, 06:19:06 AM
#1
I believe you use redSDK, in GDI they will look crisp.
However, when printing they should be like normal ( crisp )

Torfinn

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V18, V19, V20, V21, 2015/ 16/ 17/ 18 Pro. Platinum
Deluxe V20, V21, 2015/ 16/ 17
RedSDK enabled
Windows 10 Home Premium 64 bit, 32 GB
NVIDIA Geforce GTX 780m, 1 GB


* June 10, 2014, 06:49:18 AM
#2
Thank you Torfinn, switching to GDI did the trick after restarting TC.
Does redSDK always show like that in paper space? - my graphic card is compatible with redSDK - it says so when I start TC.

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Gary Wooding
Win10 64-bit,
TC21.2 x64 Plat, Bld59
TC16.2 Plat, Bld54.0
TCC 3.5


* June 10, 2014, 07:00:31 AM
#3
Yes, and i dont know if it's possible to adjust something to make it crisper, but i guess someone that work more with render will tell if possible.

Torfinn

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V18, V19, V20, V21, 2015/ 16/ 17/ 18 Pro. Platinum
Deluxe V20, V21, 2015/ 16/ 17
RedSDK enabled
Windows 10 Home Premium 64 bit, 32 GB
NVIDIA Geforce GTX 780m, 1 GB


* June 10, 2014, 02:26:56 PM
#4
You could try "Options / ACIS" and move the 'new' Faceter Quality" slider to 90—100. Pretty much like "Quality" option in earlier versions. It may not make that big a difference.

If you do try RedSDK again at some point, go to "Options / Native Draw". Under "Regeneration", click on the "Advanced" button. Checkmark what you feel might be necessary in the Automatic regeneration properties dialog. "Arcs" is a good one to have checked, otherwise circles or arcs tend to 'look like' polygons on screen, though they should print as smooth arcs if not checked (already mentioned by Torfinn).

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John R.

V17—V21, 2015—2019
Designer, Deluxe, (Professional, Expert, Basic), Platinum
RedSDK enabled
Windows 10 Pro (1803), 64-bit


June 10, 2014, 05:15:46 PM
#5
Turning on cache in viewport properties may help.

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Rip Fowler
IMSIDesign LLC


* June 10, 2014, 05:37:35 PM
#6
Are you using regular Hidden line or Redsdk HL?  For me Redsdk HL is clean but the other 2 LW and regular are not.

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* June 11, 2014, 12:19:13 AM
#7
Thanks Dave

There it was, i was using HL/ HL, switching to redsdk/ redsdk hidden line did the trick :)

I just never care about it, since the print will be ok anyway, paper or pdf. ( but not good for a screenshot )

Torfinn

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V18, V19, V20, V21, 2015/ 16/ 17/ 18 Pro. Platinum
Deluxe V20, V21, 2015/ 16/ 17
RedSDK enabled
Windows 10 Home Premium 64 bit, 32 GB
NVIDIA Geforce GTX 780m, 1 GB


* June 12, 2014, 02:22:40 AM
#8
Are you using regular Hidden line or Redsdk HL?  For me Redsdk HL is clean but the other 2 LW and regular are not.
Well, one step forward and several steps back.
RedSDK HL certainly gives crisp lines but despite not having ticked Draw hidden line as dashed, they are dashed, and placing the tick has no effect. Also, Daft, Quality, and Advanced rendering all display as blurred and blocky.
I thought that RedSDK was supposed to be an improvement - I don't see it at the moment.
Is there a setting I've missed?

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Gary Wooding
Win10 64-bit,
TC21.2 x64 Plat, Bld59
TC16.2 Plat, Bld54.0
TCC 3.5


* June 12, 2014, 03:25:00 AM
#9
Go to Option/ RedSDK and set the transparancy to 0 and the hidden line will go away, about the material i,m not sure, if you dont have the material in redSDK it will use a Ligthwork material i believe

Torfinn

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V18, V19, V20, V21, 2015/ 16/ 17/ 18 Pro. Platinum
Deluxe V20, V21, 2015/ 16/ 17
RedSDK enabled
Windows 10 Home Premium 64 bit, 32 GB
NVIDIA Geforce GTX 780m, 1 GB


* June 12, 2014, 05:32:30 AM
#10
re: …if you don't have the material in RedSDK, it will use a LigthWorks material, I believe

It doesn't use the LightWorks material. If there is no RedSDK material available, it will use the objects' Color. A user will have to create a RedSDK material in the Render Manager that is used in tandem with the LightWorks material.

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John R.

V17—V21, 2015—2019
Designer, Deluxe, (Professional, Expert, Basic), Platinum
RedSDK enabled
Windows 10 Pro (1803), 64-bit


* June 12, 2014, 10:48:36 PM
#11
I'm tearing my hair out here - how can RedSDK be so inconsistent?
Thanks to Torfinn, the hidden line problem is now resolved, but quality rendering is a nightmare.
I assigned the smooth Aluminium Lightworks material  to the model for all renders, and then used Advanced Rendering on it.

It displays rather well in Model Space, so I naively assumed it would be good in Paper Space too. It's a mess. I then printed from Paper Space using a PDF virtual printer; the advanced render is non existent, and the hidden line is a bit of a puzzle. (Come to think of it, hidden line was working fine before I altered the material.)

I've attached screenshots of the result in Model Space, Paper Space, and a PDF print from Paper Space.
Surely this can't be right, so what am I not doing, or doing wrong?
« Last Edit: June 12, 2014, 10:50:31 PM by lemel_man »

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Gary Wooding
Win10 64-bit,
TC21.2 x64 Plat, Bld59
TC16.2 Plat, Bld54.0
TCC 3.5


* June 13, 2014, 12:27:38 AM
#12
Dont know to much about renders, since i'm basically happy if there come some color on it :)
I dont have the patient to wait for it to be finish, reading about "this render only take 4 hour", or only 2 days, well, it's not not for me

Attach some pic that show how i have it in P space, Quality and Advanced, the ball have material Smoot Aluminium, maybe that can help.
In hidden line i dont use Redsdk hidden line as the Hidden line/ Hidden line looks better in my opinion.
Also tested to print virtual pdf's and they come out nice, that was with Cute pdf, didn't test it with Adobe.

Torfinn

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V18, V19, V20, V21, 2015/ 16/ 17/ 18 Pro. Platinum
Deluxe V20, V21, 2015/ 16/ 17
RedSDK enabled
Windows 10 Home Premium 64 bit, 32 GB
NVIDIA Geforce GTX 780m, 1 GB


June 13, 2014, 12:40:35 AM
#13
Redsdk is highly customizable, flexible and adapts itself to all operating platforms, thanks to its unique hybrid rendering technology that can run either using graphics hardware or in full software mode.

Maybe redSDK is stiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiill adapting to TurboCAD..........and stiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiill adapting..............and stiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiill adapting ..............and stiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiill adapting

Best Regards
Bob

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TC 14 Deluxe, TC 19 Pro
Windows 7, 64bit 8GB Ram


* June 13, 2014, 12:46:15 AM
#14
From my bit of experimenting, RedSDK can't be "printed" or "saved" to PDF; screenshots only or an image format.

I would say your part is a TC Surface object, thus the blocky/faceted look.

Their supplied materials are a mess. Some are LightWorks only, others are RedSDK only, though several can be used with both render options. I used their "Aluminum+RedSDK" material in a RedSDK Quality Raytrace Fine render.

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John R.

V17—V21, 2015—2019
Designer, Deluxe, (Professional, Expert, Basic), Platinum
RedSDK enabled
Windows 10 Pro (1803), 64-bit


* June 13, 2014, 01:05:56 AM
#15
The model is a solid, not a surface. The faceted look to the screen shot is, presumably, an artefact of the screenshot program 'cos it looks fine on the actual screen - its quite smooth.
I must say that RedSDK seems to be a total disaster at the moment - I've found no redeeming features at all. There's no point in having decent images on the screen when you can't distribute them on actual or virtual paper. Is it worth pursuing?

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Gary Wooding
Win10 64-bit,
TC21.2 x64 Plat, Bld59
TC16.2 Plat, Bld54.0
TCC 3.5


June 13, 2014, 01:27:53 AM
#16
Have you tried experimenting with Caching your Viewport? (Rip has mentioned this already)

With this you can increase the resolution of renders including hidden line. I think RedSDK hidden line is a raster image and not a Vector like hidden/hiddenline.

« Last Edit: June 13, 2014, 01:45:41 AM by Darrel Durose »

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Daz…

V2019 Plat 64bit, Lenovo P72 Laptop, Window 10 Pro for Workstations, Intel Xeon E-2186 CPU @ 2.90 Ghz (6 cores/12 threads), 32GB RAM, 512GB & 1TB SSD's, Nvidia P5200 c/w Max=Q Design GPU, Display UHD 3840 x 2160 pixels
TurboCAD user since V3 and Turbocad 3D V1.


* June 13, 2014, 09:13:53 AM
#17
Dont know to much about renders, since i'm basically happy if there come some color on it :)
I dont have the patient to wait for it to be finish, reading about "this render only take 4 hour", or only 2 days, well, it's not not for me
...
Torfinn

Laughed Out Loud at that one, Torfinn.  I feel the same way; it's one of the reasons I've resisted learning rendering techniques the past many years.  That, and I have no confidence that I can monetize the amount of time and effort it takes to produce quality renderings.  -Alvin
« Last Edit: June 13, 2014, 09:45:04 AM by Alvin Gregorio »

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Alvin Gregorio
(mostly Residential Architectural 2D; no formal CAD Training; intermittent TurboCAD user since yr. 2000 [ver6.5])
---TurboCAD: V20.2PP(57.0)[as of 3/12/15]; V19DL(54.2); V11.2Pro; Windows-7-Pro/64-bit; Intel-Core-i3 CPU; 2.27ghz; 4GB RAM; Intel HD Graphics (CPU based)


* June 13, 2014, 11:35:36 AM
#18
re: …I must say that RedSDK seems to be a total disaster at the moment - I've found no redeeming features at all. There's no point in having decent images on the screen when you can't distribute them on actual or virtual paper. Is it worth pursuing?

At the moment, I only experiment with RedSDK on the rare occasion. It may be several years before they get passed the undocumented, backwards, 'entry-level' Redway3D product they're using now for a rendering engine. I'm sticking with LightWorks.

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John R.

V17—V21, 2015—2019
Designer, Deluxe, (Professional, Expert, Basic), Platinum
RedSDK enabled
Windows 10 Pro (1803), 64-bit


* June 13, 2014, 11:58:19 AM
#19
The model is a solid, not a surface. The faceted look to the screen shot is, presumably, an artefact of the screenshot program 'cos it looks fine on the actual screen - its quite smooth.
I must say that RedSDK seems to be a total disaster at the moment - I've found no redeeming features at all. There's no point in having decent images on the screen when you can't distribute them on actual or virtual paper. Is it worth pursuing?

There is one useful feature, IMO: RedSDK Draft mode render is blazingly fast. But it is very rarely indeed that I need this feature badly enough to enable RedSDK.

Henry H

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June 13, 2014, 12:41:01 PM
#20
Another couple of reasons RedSDK option has been included:

1. For users that have massive files/complex geometry to work with.
2. Using Camera tools with higher than average complexity model/s GDI jutters where RedSDK is smooth.

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Daz…

V2019 Plat 64bit, Lenovo P72 Laptop, Window 10 Pro for Workstations, Intel Xeon E-2186 CPU @ 2.90 Ghz (6 cores/12 threads), 32GB RAM, 512GB & 1TB SSD's, Nvidia P5200 c/w Max=Q Design GPU, Display UHD 3840 x 2160 pixels
TurboCAD user since V3 and Turbocad 3D V1.


* June 14, 2014, 11:09:28 PM
#21
Thanks for your help guys, but with all the problems I've encountered I've concluded that RedSDK and Tcad is not yet a happy marriage, so I've given up for the time being.

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Gary Wooding
Win10 64-bit,
TC21.2 x64 Plat, Bld59
TC16.2 Plat, Bld54.0
TCC 3.5


* July 18, 2014, 04:24:21 PM
#22
Thanks for your feedback guys.  I will pass it on to both our dev team and Redway's

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