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Best Practice - Creating Sheets from a Model ? TCP20
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* November 13, 2013, 03:32:39 AM
#50
did you try to put a new opening in when you were in edit block mode?
It doesn't work on my system - never has in any version.

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Nikki
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* November 13, 2013, 04:17:01 AM
#51
Hi Nikki

No, thats not possible ( i believe ), you will have to go out of edit mode before insert a different opening in the wall.

I can clearly se the benefit of making doors and windows by opening tool, with possebility to add attributt's that can be taken out by database or a table, and if you basicaly work with some standard type of walls, everything is predefined to perfect fit.
But i dont understand why you need/ want to insert a new opening in the wall when standing in block edit ??

Torfinn

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* November 13, 2013, 04:41:43 AM
#52
I change my mind a lot
For openings I use custom properties (because openings come in as groups and I haven't found a way to extract attributes from a block within a group.) I have about 15 custom properties for glass doors. I would have to change all that info manually. Why? when its easier to delete and bring in a new opening. And what happens when I need a new opening?
« Last Edit: November 13, 2013, 04:45:14 AM by nikkipollard »

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Nikki
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* November 13, 2013, 05:02:50 AM
#53
If I can help clear things up, Nikki and Torfinn.  I think I understand where you two aren't getting each other.

It starts with the discussion of the use of the Drafting Palette (versus Viewports).  It has been offered and accepted-- on this Topic-- that the only way for users to get Drafting Palette views to update is if the Drafting Palette Objects are that of a Block, including the optional External Reference Block.

That's where Nikki contributed the tip:  "Note the architectural opening tool doesn't work in block edit mode" (Reply #40).

Torfinn seems to be questioning why use the Architectural Opening tool in Block Edit mode: yes, we know, it doesn't work in Block Edit mode, so use it in Modelspace.

But it seems to be accepted that the Drafting Palette views do not update if they are from Objects from Modelspace.

Which brings the discussion/non-understanding between Nikki and Torfinn back full-circle.


EDIT:  But it does bring to mind a question:  The Help Documentation indicates that there is an "Update" Drafting Palette views option.  Why is there that option/function, if users cannot update from Modelspace?  Is it just that it's a feature that is broken?
« Last Edit: November 13, 2013, 05:20:30 AM by Alvin Gregorio »

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Alvin Gregorio
(mostly Residential Architectural 2D; no formal CAD Training; intermittent TurboCAD user since yr. 2000 [ver6.5])
---TurboCAD: V20.2PP(57.0)[as of 3/12/15]; V19DL(54.2); V11.2Pro; Windows-7-Pro/64-bit; Intel-Core-i3 CPU; 2.27ghz; 4GB RAM; Intel HD Graphics (CPU based)


* November 13, 2013, 08:05:59 AM
#54
I change my mind a lot
For openings I use custom properties (because openings come in as groups and I haven't found a way to extract attributes from a block within a group.) I have about 15 custom properties for glass doors. I would have to change all that info manually. Why? when its easier to delete and bring in a new opening. And what happens when I need a new opening?

 :)Nikki you can extract the data from objects or Entity marks with a database from the “block” while in “EC” and or you can create an optional database in “model space”. there are (which you know) numerous ways of extracting the data.  As for Drafting assembly > elevation views, these can easily be created and are updated when changes are made.  > did you see my last video?

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* November 13, 2013, 09:25:18 AM
#55
I was not wonder why you want to change the block, for that there could be a million reason, i wonder why this need to happens you need to insert a new block in the same time as you were in edit mode, i.e. Block Editor :)
The edit mode is in many way like a woman think the male brain work, 1 thing at the time  ;) :) in my opinion

Torfinn
« Last Edit: November 13, 2013, 09:57:40 AM by Torfinn »

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* November 13, 2013, 05:15:19 PM
#56
Dean the viewport system works well for me. I can see the merits of the drafting palette but it doesn't work with the way I draw.
I have tried it  and been disappointed when I couldn't change the drawing the way I wanted to. I ended up exploding the block which was a bad move because everything lost its associativity with the walls.

Torfinn my whole model would be a block. To edit it I would need to be in the block edit mode.

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* November 13, 2013, 05:39:07 PM
#57
Dean the viewport system works well for me. I can see the merits of the drafting palette but it doesn't work with the way I draw.
I have tried it  and been disappointed when I couldn't change the drawing the way I wanted to. I ended up exploding the block which was a bad move because everything lost its associativity with the walls.

Torfinn my whole model would be a block. To edit it I would need to be in the block edit mode.

And there's nothing wrong with using both Viewports and the Drafting Palette; using one doesn't necessarily exclude beneficially using the other.

Example:  What if you, Nikki, had some elaborate timber-frame trusses in the house you are modeling and creating construction drawings of.  Along with your normal Viewports, and perhaps some, Perspective View Viewports or something--  just for "eye candy" and referencing--  you could have a Block that is your timber-frame trusses, and you could use the Drafting Palette in Paperspace to detail to the craftsmen exactly how to build the trusses.  For example.

Or what if you had a very custom cabinet that you wanted built exactly as you envision, complete with some very detailed interior shevling.  Again, you could make that a Block, and insert the construction details in Paperspace via the Drafting Palette. With that cabinet in place in the middle of your house model somewhere, it would be tedious to get all the view and sectionals, etc. into Paperspace via Viewports... the Drafting Palette would work well for that type of construction detail as well.

It is my belief that one does not have to use either Viewports or the Drafting Palette exclusive of each other in the same drawing; and in fact, a user could likely benefit from using both.

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Alvin Gregorio
(mostly Residential Architectural 2D; no formal CAD Training; intermittent TurboCAD user since yr. 2000 [ver6.5])
---TurboCAD: V20.2PP(57.0)[as of 3/12/15]; V19DL(54.2); V11.2Pro; Windows-7-Pro/64-bit; Intel-Core-i3 CPU; 2.27ghz; 4GB RAM; Intel HD Graphics (CPU based)


* November 13, 2013, 05:53:08 PM
#58
Dean the viewport system works well for me. I can see the merits of the drafting palette but it doesn't work with the way I draw.
I have tried it  and been disappointed when I couldn't change the drawing the way I wanted to. I ended up exploding the block which was a bad move because everything lost its associativity with the walls.

Torfinn my whole model would be a block. To edit it I would need to be in the block edit mode.

Ok, Thanx Nikki for explaining further on the issue.
There really should be a “warning dialog ” for when you explode a block linked to an architectural object.  ;)I’ve been there myself more than a few times.

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Windows 7 64 bit HP > on a stock HP laptop with 4gb-2.4 GHz.Turbocad 2019-2018-2017, TurboCad Platinum 21.Using Lightworks and Redsdk, Anilab lab 5. ATI Mobility Radeon HD 4500/5100 and HP all in one desktop with Nvidia Geforce 210, open gl 3.3


* November 14, 2013, 12:06:16 PM
#59
Very interesting discussion and feedback.  Thanks to the group for providing such detail.   I will discuss with development to see if what we can do to make the DP more useful based on this feedback.

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* November 14, 2013, 12:20:09 PM
#60
One thing we didn't discuss here:  Dimensioning and Annotating.

For good reason, many users prefer to Dimension and Annotate (via Leader Dimensions and Text) in Modelspace; there's been many good discussion points over the years supporting this.  With Viewports and Layer Sets, that can easily be accomplished.

Using the Drafting Palette, it has to be done in Paperspace.  Which is okay, if you want to-- or are willing to make the change to-- work(ing) this way.

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Alvin Gregorio
(mostly Residential Architectural 2D; no formal CAD Training; intermittent TurboCAD user since yr. 2000 [ver6.5])
---TurboCAD: V20.2PP(57.0)[as of 3/12/15]; V19DL(54.2); V11.2Pro; Windows-7-Pro/64-bit; Intel-Core-i3 CPU; 2.27ghz; 4GB RAM; Intel HD Graphics (CPU based)


* November 15, 2013, 03:17:57 AM
#61
I concur with Dave Taylor.  Thanks to everyone for such a detailed response to a question I never thought would generate such good insight.  ("What a TEAM!") 

Since my last post, I've been building sheets in my model - - which may be risky, since I have everything in one file -- and stumbled across a problem that may be something I'm doing wrong: 

When I use the camera and layer sets to save a section view from my model to use with a viewport, and place the viewport in my sheet, I get all layers turned on when I select my saved view from the viewport dialog upon finishing the insert viewport tool.  Then I have to manually un-check all layers not needed in that viewport.  I thought the later sets was supposed to be active in that saved view????

What am I doing wrong?


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* November 15, 2013, 05:27:00 AM
#62
I concur with Dave Taylor.  Thanks to everyone for such a detailed response to a question I never thought would generate such good insight.  ("What a TEAM!") 

Since my last post, I've been building sheets in my model - - which may be risky, since I have everything in one file -- and stumbled across a problem that may be something I'm doing wrong: 

When I use the camera and layer sets to save a section view from my model to use with a viewport, and place the viewport in my sheet, I get all layers turned on when I select my saved view from the viewport dialog upon finishing the insert viewport tool.  Then I have to manually un-check all layers not needed in that viewport.  I thought the later sets was supposed to be active in that saved view????

What am I doing wrong?

Unless it's changed with version-20:

You have to pre-define your Layer Sets in Modelspace.  Then-- in Paperspace Viewports-- towards the bottom-right of the Viewports' Properties|Viewport page, you select the Layer Set you want to use for that particular Viewport.

I set up my Layer Sets-- in Modelspace-- and work with them in Modelspace, to mimic the eventual Layers I want to show (i.e.: a "Layer Set") in my eventual Viewports in Paperspace.   Example:  I have Layer Sets named "Foundation"; "Floor Framing"; "1st-Floor Floorplan"; "Framing"; "2nd-Flr. Floor-Framing"; "Sectionals"; etc.

----
One thing that I have done recently that I like:  Via my Customize Workplace function, I have dragged out a Layer Sets button to the very right side of my Menu toolbar, so that I can quickly and easily toggle between the different Layer Sets, including "All Layers".
« Last Edit: November 15, 2013, 05:33:58 AM by Alvin Gregorio »

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Alvin Gregorio
(mostly Residential Architectural 2D; no formal CAD Training; intermittent TurboCAD user since yr. 2000 [ver6.5])
---TurboCAD: V20.2PP(57.0)[as of 3/12/15]; V19DL(54.2); V11.2Pro; Windows-7-Pro/64-bit; Intel-Core-i3 CPU; 2.27ghz; 4GB RAM; Intel HD Graphics (CPU based)


* November 15, 2013, 02:02:04 PM
#63
I found it!  That is nice.  Thanks Alvin
I also like your idea about the command button to launch the LS manager.

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* November 15, 2013, 02:28:32 PM
#64
I found it!  That is nice.  Thanks Alvin
I also like your idea about the command button to launch the LS manager.

Hi Eddie.  My "idea" wasn't so much about "the command button to launch the LS manager".  Rather, it was simply relocating the "Layer Sets" button, which is normally found via Menu->View->Layer Set, which allows us to toggle to the Layer Set we want active while drawing in Modelspace.

I toggle through my Layer Sets so much, that I found (per advice from another user, this Forum... Bob Burgess?; Jon Coxwell?... don't remember) that I want it to be one-click less to get to it.  See below screen-capture.

----Incidentally, that "Layer Set 0" you see there in my screen-capture is the result of:  In a Viewport's Properties|Viewport dialogue page, adding or deleting a Layer up in the individual "sub-window", where we can choose individual Layers.  When we do that, the resulting Layers that are visible in the Viewport are different than a particular Layer Set, so TurboCAD assigns its own name.  I have found-- if you are tempted to just "clean house", and delete that TurboCAD-named-Layer Set--  don't do it; the Viewport that is using it will revert to All Layers being visible (I believe that's correct; someone more experienced than I might want to substantiate that.  I know for sure that it does have unexpected/undesired consequences.)

-Alvin

[EDIT:]  After searching these Forums, I found that previous Topic discussion, regarding that "Layer Set" button, and moving it to the Menu Bar.  Seems that some version-20 users were having issues with not only being able to relocate the button, but having issues with working with Layers and Layer Sets if/once it was relocated.  I am working with version-19.2-Deluxe (Build 54.2), so I do not know if this has been remedied with updates to version-20.  Just be aware,... I guess I'm saying.
Link to that Topic here.
« Last Edit: November 15, 2013, 03:06:23 PM by Alvin Gregorio »

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Alvin Gregorio
(mostly Residential Architectural 2D; no formal CAD Training; intermittent TurboCAD user since yr. 2000 [ver6.5])
---TurboCAD: V20.2PP(57.0)[as of 3/12/15]; V19DL(54.2); V11.2Pro; Windows-7-Pro/64-bit; Intel-Core-i3 CPU; 2.27ghz; 4GB RAM; Intel HD Graphics (CPU based)


* November 16, 2013, 04:59:51 AM
#65

Once again using a drawing from the samples folder, I selected the architectural elements needed to create my drafting assembly elevation view. After inserting the drafting assembly in the drawing I then changed the style of window which is an (2d-3d block insertion) and the drafting assembly updated. This is great for those demanding clients. Does this help? Or is it I’m not following you.

Where is the Sample Folder located?  I have the download version, I it isn't included, would anyone be willing to post the sample file Dean used in his video?

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* November 16, 2013, 06:00:43 AM
#66

Where is the Sample Folder located?  I have the download version, I it isn't included, would anyone be willing to post the sample file Dean used in his video?

Eddie, My version-19 is a downloaded install as well.  My Samples Folder is located here:

C:\Users\Alvin Gregorio\Documents\TurboCAD Deluxe 19\Documents

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Alvin Gregorio
(mostly Residential Architectural 2D; no formal CAD Training; intermittent TurboCAD user since yr. 2000 [ver6.5])
---TurboCAD: V20.2PP(57.0)[as of 3/12/15]; V19DL(54.2); V11.2Pro; Windows-7-Pro/64-bit; Intel-Core-i3 CPU; 2.27ghz; 4GB RAM; Intel HD Graphics (CPU based)