TurboCAD Forums

The Ultimate Resource for TurboCAD Knowledge

Register
 
The purpose of these forums is to discuss TurboCAD.  Please keep the discussion of other products to compatibility issues or how the other software’s can be used with TurboCAD.


What are Layers Filters? (version 19 Deluxe)
Read 8431 times
* March 30, 2013, 05:23:10 PM
There's a bit of a learning-curve, coming from version 11 Pro, and going full-tilt into version 19.2 Deluxe, drawing a 20k sf building.


In version 11, I'm used to very much utilizing Layer Sets; in version 11, there is no such items as Layer Templates and Layer Filters.

I am drawing what will become multi-sheet (12?), multi-Layer (50?) construction plans for a commercial building.  I am drawing in 2D in Model Space.  I just "pile" everything on top of each other on different Layers (except for the Elevations).  I am used to using Layer Sets to display (and use in Viewports in Paperspace) only the Layers germain to each sheet (i.e.: Foundation, Floorplan, Framing, Roof, etc.).

But maybe I'm missing the boat with this Layers Filters thing.  What's the 101 on Layers Filters?  And- in my type of drawing- should I be trying to learn and use them?

Thanks, Alvin
« Last Edit: March 30, 2013, 06:47:52 PM by Alvin Gregorio »

Logged
Alvin Gregorio
(mostly Residential Architectural 2D; no formal CAD Training; intermittent TurboCAD user since yr. 2000 [ver6.5])
---TurboCAD: V20.2PP(57.0)[as of 3/12/15]; V19DL(54.2); V11.2Pro; Windows-7-Pro/64-bit; Intel-Core-i3 CPU; 2.27ghz; 4GB RAM; Intel HD Graphics (CPU based)


* March 30, 2013, 06:21:42 PM
#1
Layer sets can be very handy, for controlling different part's of a drawing, i use 15 different set's, i.e. one LS for every story, if you dont want to se that spesiffic story you can turn it of by one click, imagen that there is 20-50 layer in every set, timesaving to change all in one time(click), if there maybe is a full drawing with electric,plumber,avac,furniture etc etc in 1 drawing, it's very easy to take away what you dont want to see, change pen color etc

Torfinn

Logged
V18, V19, V20, V21, 2015/ 16/ 17/ 18 Pro. Platinum
Deluxe V20, V21, 2015/ 16/ 17
RedSDK enabled
Windows 10 Home Premium 64 bit, 32 GB
NVIDIA Geforce GTX 780m, 1 GB


* March 30, 2013, 06:59:24 PM
#2
Layer sets can be very handy, for controlling different part's of a drawing, i use 15 different set's, i.e. one LS for every story, if you dont want to se that spesiffic story you can turn it of by one click, imagen that there is 20-50 layer in every set, timesaving to change all in one time(click), if there maybe is a full drawing with electric,plumber,avac,furniture etc etc in 1 drawing, it's very easy to take away what you dont want to see, change pen color etc

Torfinn

Hi Torfinn.  And- if you recognize/celebrate it- Happy Easter.

----
Thanks for your Reply, Torfinn.  I think I need an even more elementary/simplified explanation of what Layers Filters is/are.  And how they differ from Layer Sets.

Thanks, Alvin

Logged
Alvin Gregorio
(mostly Residential Architectural 2D; no formal CAD Training; intermittent TurboCAD user since yr. 2000 [ver6.5])
---TurboCAD: V20.2PP(57.0)[as of 3/12/15]; V19DL(54.2); V11.2Pro; Windows-7-Pro/64-bit; Intel-Core-i3 CPU; 2.27ghz; 4GB RAM; Intel HD Graphics (CPU based)


* March 31, 2013, 02:30:36 AM
#3
Hi Alvin

Happy Easter

I dont celebrate it, but it's a nice time, becuase i then can work in peace, no phone's, nothing i have to go and look on, Norway is basicly " closed " from Wedensday afternoon to Thuesday morning :)
and for me a working day is a day ho end with a Y  :o

About the filter's, if you see at the png, i have about 90 layers in my standard template, take long time to scroll down to the last one if i want to do something with it, so that,s the best thing about the filter's, it work in many way like a folder and have the same benefit's, i can turn of everyting, maybe leave only 1 of the layers open if thats what i need/ want, i don't have a list in DD that's going from here to heaven, that's not possible for the Layer Set's, in Layer Set's, there it is on/ off and that's it.

This is how i use it basicly, a better explonation, wait for John R or sombody ho know TC better then me :):)

Torfinn

Logged
V18, V19, V20, V21, 2015/ 16/ 17/ 18 Pro. Platinum
Deluxe V20, V21, 2015/ 16/ 17
RedSDK enabled
Windows 10 Home Premium 64 bit, 32 GB
NVIDIA Geforce GTX 780m, 1 GB


* April 02, 2013, 03:27:16 AM
#4
Maybe this drawing will help a little (originally a Pro drawing). It has most everything for the three floors filtered in the Design Director; Basement, 1st Floor and 2nd Floor. Turn the 'eye' off on the main heading and the sub-layers turn off.

The Layer Filters article in the Wiki might help.

Logged
John R.

V17—V21, 2015—2018
Designer, Deluxe, Expert, Basic, Platinum
RedSDK enabled
Windows 10 Pro, 64-bit


* April 02, 2013, 06:08:15 AM
#5
Maybe this drawing will help a little (originally a Pro drawing). It has most everything for the three floors filtered in the Design Director; Basement, 1st Floor and 2nd Floor. Turn the 'eye' off on the main heading and the sub-layers turn off.

The Layer Filters article in the Wiki might help.

Yeah, John, the file and the Wiki article helped a lot; especially the Wiki article.  It's not like me to post a question like this without first searching the Wiki- I guess I didn't scroll down far enough in the Wiki after getting my search results.

I now understand what Layer Filters are, and how to utilize them.  I also now understand- conceptually (that's important)-  how they differ from Layer Sets.

----
Seem like for the past many versions, IMSI/Design-TurboCAD has made the decision to move towards being more "compatible"/"interchangeable" with AutoCAD.  There are a lot of almost redundancies now because of that:  This Layer Filters vs. Layer Sets is one example; all the "Styles" versus Property Value Preset (legacy versions= "Style"); Door & Window"Styles" and the way we can insert them, vs. the very close "Opening" ; I'm sure I could think of additional.

Once I had wrapped my head around what was happening in the recent versions-  that IMSI/Design-TurboCAD was adding "features" that make it more compatible with AutoCAD, but not removing existing features (we now have a lot of "features" to choose from-  many almost-redundant)-  I have found my working with the version 19 a little less frustrating (remember- I jumped from ol'-reliable version 11.2 to 19); I just keep telling myself "oh, that "feature" is just there for those who are used to AutoCAD and/or want to import/export to/from AutoCAD- I don't need to use it.

----
Anyway- Thanks a bunch John for posting the link and the file; I now have a thorough understanding of the Layer Filter feature- it seems to be a good "tool", and I might actually move to it from Layer Sets, or use it in conjunction with.

-Alvin

Logged
Alvin Gregorio
(mostly Residential Architectural 2D; no formal CAD Training; intermittent TurboCAD user since yr. 2000 [ver6.5])
---TurboCAD: V20.2PP(57.0)[as of 3/12/15]; V19DL(54.2); V11.2Pro; Windows-7-Pro/64-bit; Intel-Core-i3 CPU; 2.27ghz; 4GB RAM; Intel HD Graphics (CPU based)


* April 02, 2013, 06:14:44 AM
#6
Maybe this drawing will help a little (originally a Pro drawing). It has most everything for the three floors filtered in the Design Director; Basement, 1st Floor and 2nd Floor. Turn the 'eye' off on the main heading and the sub-layers turn off.

The Layer Filters article in the Wiki might help.

In the file John provided, I cannot seem to "Activate" a Layer Filter (activate a Layer Filter such that only the Layers in that Layer Filter are displayed).

I've tried at least four of the possible methods (various checkmarks in Design Director and Layers Management; as well as right-click and trying to select "Activate" [it's grayed out] in both DD and LM).

Should I-  shouldn't I-  be able to do that?  If so, does the fact that it was originated in ver.19-Pro, and I am working with it in ver.19-Deluxe, have anything to do with why I can't seem to "Activate" the Layers Filters?

Thanks, Alvin
« Last Edit: April 02, 2013, 06:17:49 AM by Alvin Gregorio »

Logged
Alvin Gregorio
(mostly Residential Architectural 2D; no formal CAD Training; intermittent TurboCAD user since yr. 2000 [ver6.5])
---TurboCAD: V20.2PP(57.0)[as of 3/12/15]; V19DL(54.2); V11.2Pro; Windows-7-Pro/64-bit; Intel-Core-i3 CPU; 2.27ghz; 4GB RAM; Intel HD Graphics (CPU based)


* April 02, 2013, 06:56:39 AM
#7
I belive Layers Filter Set only is in pro and pro platium

Torfinn

Logged
V18, V19, V20, V21, 2015/ 16/ 17/ 18 Pro. Platinum
Deluxe V20, V21, 2015/ 16/ 17
RedSDK enabled
Windows 10 Home Premium 64 bit, 32 GB
NVIDIA Geforce GTX 780m, 1 GB


* April 02, 2013, 07:10:17 AM
#8
I belive Layers Filter Set only is in pro and pro platium

Torfinn

Hi Torfinn,

Yes, now I see in the TurboWiki (at the top of the page that John provided a link to, this Topic) that Layer Filters are indeed not in Deluxe.  I checked on John's-provided Comparison-Charts, and there was no mention, one way or the other-  at least not one that I could quickly find.

So, I guess in Deluxe, I can see everything about the Layers Filters (which I have been for the past few weeks of using 19-Deluxe; I mean- the "tool" is there... everywhere), except I just cannot utilize the "feature" in Deluxe (hence:  you can see why I originally posted this question/Topic).

-Alvin

Logged
Alvin Gregorio
(mostly Residential Architectural 2D; no formal CAD Training; intermittent TurboCAD user since yr. 2000 [ver6.5])
---TurboCAD: V20.2PP(57.0)[as of 3/12/15]; V19DL(54.2); V11.2Pro; Windows-7-Pro/64-bit; Intel-Core-i3 CPU; 2.27ghz; 4GB RAM; Intel HD Graphics (CPU based)


* April 02, 2013, 09:57:51 AM
#9
I belive Layers Filter Set only is in pro and pro platium

Torfinn

What a tease! :(

In version 19.2 Deluxe, I can do everything with Layers Filters, except Activate them.    :-\

-Alvin

Logged
Alvin Gregorio
(mostly Residential Architectural 2D; no formal CAD Training; intermittent TurboCAD user since yr. 2000 [ver6.5])
---TurboCAD: V20.2PP(57.0)[as of 3/12/15]; V19DL(54.2); V11.2Pro; Windows-7-Pro/64-bit; Intel-Core-i3 CPU; 2.27ghz; 4GB RAM; Intel HD Graphics (CPU based)


* April 02, 2013, 11:20:59 AM
#10
If it look like something as attaced ?? and not work, upgrade to v 20 Deluxe , there it work's  ;)
Just checked

Torfinn

Logged
V18, V19, V20, V21, 2015/ 16/ 17/ 18 Pro. Platinum
Deluxe V20, V21, 2015/ 16/ 17
RedSDK enabled
Windows 10 Home Premium 64 bit, 32 GB
NVIDIA Geforce GTX 780m, 1 GB


* April 02, 2013, 11:31:09 AM
#11
If it look like something as attaced ?? and not work, upgrade to v 20 Deluxe , there it work's  ;)
Just checked

Torfinn

Hi Torfinn,

Yes, it looked exactly like that.  I am (we are?) fully able to set up Layers Filters in version 19-Deluxe, just not able to actually Activate any of the Layers Filters.

There's no way I'd "upgrade" to version 20-Deluxe at this time (unless the commercial-construction company I am currently contracted with on a project does so); as I said just recently in another Topic: I have no interest in waiting that typical many-months before they get 20 functioning fully, with few-to-no bugs.

If anything, my next upgrade is to vesion 19.2 Pro-Platinum; that is very likely to occur soon.

Thanks Tofinn.  Nice to be sitting here in the hot/dry middle of California and communicate with the man from Norway. :D  -Alvin

Logged
Alvin Gregorio
(mostly Residential Architectural 2D; no formal CAD Training; intermittent TurboCAD user since yr. 2000 [ver6.5])
---TurboCAD: V20.2PP(57.0)[as of 3/12/15]; V19DL(54.2); V11.2Pro; Windows-7-Pro/64-bit; Intel-Core-i3 CPU; 2.27ghz; 4GB RAM; Intel HD Graphics (CPU based)


* April 02, 2013, 01:09:08 PM
#12
Hi Alvin

Da..., no sale for IMSI  ;D
I totaly agree with you, i would also prefered to buy 19 pro platium before 20 Deluxe, bug or no bug.

About dry, we also have it exeptional dry for the moment, but i'm affraid you beat me on the temperature, belowe zero in the nigth and 3-5 degree at max in daytime, so far this "spring" there have been 85 gras fire compered to 100 all last year, they are figthing with one rigth now, that is only about 10 km from my home, but no problem, i have a "fjord" between and the wind go's in a different direction, i even dont notice the smell

Torfinn

Logged
V18, V19, V20, V21, 2015/ 16/ 17/ 18 Pro. Platinum
Deluxe V20, V21, 2015/ 16/ 17
RedSDK enabled
Windows 10 Home Premium 64 bit, 32 GB
NVIDIA Geforce GTX 780m, 1 GB


* April 02, 2013, 01:52:40 PM
#13
Alvin,

I believe what you want are Layer Templates. That can be 'activated' so that only those layers in the 'template' are visible. Layer Filters work a bit differently. The Design Director has a lot features for hiding stuff; such as the Graphic and Category options.

Maybe this YouTube video will help with Templates & Filters: http://youtu.be/YIVa6XyHgZg

Logged
John R.

V17—V21, 2015—2018
Designer, Deluxe, Expert, Basic, Platinum
RedSDK enabled
Windows 10 Pro, 64-bit


* April 02, 2013, 02:42:34 PM
#14
Alvin,

I believe what you want are Layer Templates. That can be 'activated' so that only those layers in the 'template' are visible. Layer Filters work a bit differently. The Design Director has a lot features for hiding stuff; such as the Graphic and Category options.

Maybe this YouTube video will help with Templates & Filters: http://youtu.be/YIVa6XyHgZg

I'll watch the video you linked John.  (I think I'm looking for Filters, but maybe I'm wrong; remember, the original question I had, this Topic, was something like "what are Layers Filters, and how do they differ from Layer Sets?"  Coming from version 11, I can probably live with just using Layer Sets.)

----
I searched the Wiki John, but I didn't find an indepth article on Layer Templates, such as the one you linked in your earlier Post, this Topic, regarding Layers Filters.  Do you quickly have a link to that Wiki Layer Templates article?  Does one exist?

Also:  At the top of the Wiki article on Layers Filters, I saw that "Deluxe" was crossed-out, indicating that Layers Filters is "dis-abled" in version 19-Deluxe; is that correct?  Is Layer Templates, likewise "dis-abled" in verson 19-Deluxe?

----
Thanks John.   -Alvin

Logged
Alvin Gregorio
(mostly Residential Architectural 2D; no formal CAD Training; intermittent TurboCAD user since yr. 2000 [ver6.5])
---TurboCAD: V20.2PP(57.0)[as of 3/12/15]; V19DL(54.2); V11.2Pro; Windows-7-Pro/64-bit; Intel-Core-i3 CPU; 2.27ghz; 4GB RAM; Intel HD Graphics (CPU based)


* April 02, 2013, 03:32:30 PM
#15
The only mention that I see is in the Design Director page: Design Director: Layers. There's not much. When that Wiki page went up years ago, Filters wasn't available to Deluxe users. It finally became available in 17 or 18. The Wiki has been inaccessible (at least to me) since September of last year. I don't know if anything will ever be changed on that site.

Logged
John R.

V17—V21, 2015—2018
Designer, Deluxe, Expert, Basic, Platinum
RedSDK enabled
Windows 10 Pro, 64-bit


* April 02, 2013, 03:59:11 PM
#16
The only mention that I see is in the Design Director page: Design Director: Layers. There's not much. When that Wiki page went up years ago, Filters wasn't available to Deluxe users. It finally became available in 17 or 18. The Wiki has been inaccessible (at least to me) since September of last year. I don't know if anything will ever be changed on that site.

Okay.  Thanks for checking that John.  Too bad about the TurboWiki not being accessible for entries by- especially- you expert users; there's a wealth of easy-to-comprehend knowledge in there.

----
Watching and working with your YouTube video now, in conjunction with trying to replicate some of it in my own drawing (not the "AG LayerFilters.tcw" file you provided-  "refresh-rate" for me, using that drawing in Deluxe, is very erratic and slow).

I can now see that I/we can Activate Layer Templates and Layers Filters in version-19-Deluxe.  I'm going to have to work with it more to get a true understanding of how to beneficially utilize both of those features.

----
Question:  Since I depend on using Layer Sets in Viewports in Paperspace, and I like to work in Modelspace using the same Layer Sets that will be in the eventual Viewports (I like to work with what the actual printed sheet is going to look like- as close as possible), would it make sense for me to work with Layer Templates and Layers Filters in Modelspace- as opposed to Layer Sets?  To do otherwise seems that it would add some confusion- if the Layer Templates and Layers Filters that I am working with in Modelspace differ from the Layer Sets- when I create Viewports in Paperspace and select certain Layer Sets in the Viewports.

Would I be better off just sticking with Layer Sets in 2D Architectural drafting of full-set construction-drawings, that have about 40 Layers and about 8 Layer Sets, and 70% of the drawing Objects are "all piled on top of each other" on different Layers?

[EDIT:]  I guess I am back to one of the original questions:  Should I be using Layer Templates and Layers Filters instead of Layer Sets; to use both (the pair LT & LF, and Layer Sets) seems redundant and confusing.

----
Thanks again, John, for creating and posting on YouTube the video (sure wish it had some audio instruction/guide) and for searching the Wiki.

-Alvin
« Last Edit: April 02, 2013, 04:02:56 PM by Alvin Gregorio »

Logged
Alvin Gregorio
(mostly Residential Architectural 2D; no formal CAD Training; intermittent TurboCAD user since yr. 2000 [ver6.5])
---TurboCAD: V20.2PP(57.0)[as of 3/12/15]; V19DL(54.2); V11.2Pro; Windows-7-Pro/64-bit; Intel-Core-i3 CPU; 2.27ghz; 4GB RAM; Intel HD Graphics (CPU based)


* April 02, 2013, 04:13:04 PM
#17
Alvin,

I believe what you want are Layer Templates. That can be 'activated' so that only those layers in the 'template' are visible. Layer Filters work a bit differently. The Design Director has a lot features for hiding stuff; such as the Graphic and Category options.

Maybe this YouTube video will help with Templates & Filters: http://youtu.be/YIVa6XyHgZg

Studying your video, John.


The question that keeps coming to my mind:

I notice that your Layer Templates have the exact same names as your Layers Filters.  Did those Layer Template names auto-populate, or did you have to manually create them and type in the names?  If you manually entered the names, is it necessary to have the exact same names as your Layers Filters?

I mean:  Within the program, how do Layer Template names and Layers Filters names relate to each other?

-Alvin

Logged
Alvin Gregorio
(mostly Residential Architectural 2D; no formal CAD Training; intermittent TurboCAD user since yr. 2000 [ver6.5])
---TurboCAD: V20.2PP(57.0)[as of 3/12/15]; V19DL(54.2); V11.2Pro; Windows-7-Pro/64-bit; Intel-Core-i3 CPU; 2.27ghz; 4GB RAM; Intel HD Graphics (CPU based)


* April 02, 2013, 05:19:11 PM
#18
re: …Did those Layer Template names auto-populate, or did you have to manually create them and type in the names?

I had to create the names for the Layer Template, then select the layers I wanted for that particular Template. I always have "0" in a selection so that it's never turned off.

As for Templates—vs—Sets? I've never used either, except for testing. Ever since they introduced Layer Templates, Layer Sets have never worked well, IMO.

Logged
John R.

V17—V21, 2015—2018
Designer, Deluxe, Expert, Basic, Platinum
RedSDK enabled
Windows 10 Pro, 64-bit


* April 02, 2013, 05:26:29 PM
#19
re: …Did those Layer Template names auto-populate, or did you have to manually create them and type in the names?

I had to create the names for the Layer Template, then select the layers I wanted for that particular Template. I always have "0" in a selection so that it's never turned off.

As for Templates—vs—Sets? I've never used either, except for testing. Ever since they introduced Layer Templates, Layer Sets have never worked well, IMO.

Okay.

Thank you very much for all your help on this Topic, John.  -Alvin

Logged
Alvin Gregorio
(mostly Residential Architectural 2D; no formal CAD Training; intermittent TurboCAD user since yr. 2000 [ver6.5])
---TurboCAD: V20.2PP(57.0)[as of 3/12/15]; V19DL(54.2); V11.2Pro; Windows-7-Pro/64-bit; Intel-Core-i3 CPU; 2.27ghz; 4GB RAM; Intel HD Graphics (CPU based)


April 04, 2013, 03:09:33 PM
#20
Alvin,

I read through your thread today and will offer this.  I used layer sets as you do in earlier versions but when the changes were made to be more compatible with AutoCad in V12 I think they were no longer available in the design director.  I switched to layer templates to replace them.  They work almost the same except you can save the template as a file and reload it into other drawings.  I have a standard set of layers of approx. 100 layers.  I have probably 12 different layer templates for those layers to separate my work by floor and discipline. (first floor plan, first floor electrical plan, foundation plan, etc.  When I start a job I start with my drawing template which has all the layers in it.  I then load the layer templates and I am ready to go.  One thing that you cannot do is access layer templates from the properties dialog to turn on the layers in a new paper space.  What I do is activate the layers in model space with a layers template and then create my paper space.  The paper space will have the same layer configuration as model space when you create it.  I usually create my paper spaces as I go so they match the model space at the time.  I use platinum but I still have not gotten my head around layer filters.  Will watch John's movie as he has a better understanding than I.

Hope this helps

Logged
Jon Coxwell, AIA
Windows Win 7x64
TC19,20 32 bit, 20,21,22 64 bit (Platinum)
RedSDK usually off  Win 10 pro

Save the Planet
Conserve & Recycle


* April 04, 2013, 04:04:49 PM
#21
Alvin,

I read through your thread today and will offer this.  I used layer sets as you do in earlier versions but when the changes were made to be more compatible with AutoCad in V12 I think they were no longer available in the design director.  I switched to layer templates to replace them.  They work almost the same except you can save the template as a file and reload it into other drawings.  I have a standard set of layers of approx. 100 layers.  I have probably 12 different layer templates for those layers to separate my work by floor and discipline. (first floor plan, first floor electrical plan, foundation plan, etc.  When I start a job I start with my drawing template which has all the layers in it.  I then load the layer templates and I am ready to go.  One thing that you cannot do is access layer templates from the properties dialog to turn on the layers in a new paper space.  What I do is activate the layers in model space with a layers template and then create my paper space.  The paper space will have the same layer configuration as model space when you create it.  I usually create my paper spaces as I go so they match the model space at the time.  I use platinum but I still have not gotten my head around layer filters.  Will watch John's movie as he has a better understanding than I.

Hope this helps

Hi Jon,

You're coming from an Architectural "viewpoint", and utilizing Layer Templates, suggests to me that I should give it another try-  with a bit more confidence in them.

----
I still use Layer Sets in version-19-Deluxe-  as I did in version 11-  but as you said, Layer Sets are not available in Design Director.  I've never been in the habit of using Design Director, so my using Layer Sets (via the recently moved-to-Menu Bar location) still works pretty well for me in version-19-Deluxe; and I can still use the Layer Sets option in Paperspace Viewports Properties.

----
I'll give it another go with Layer Templates, but I sort of made up my mind-  on all these overlapping, redundant, features that are trying to "keep up with" AutoCAD-  to stick with the "eldest"/"simplest" (TurboCAD) feature (Layer Sets, in this case).

----
Thank you for the input, Jon.  -Alvin

Logged
Alvin Gregorio
(mostly Residential Architectural 2D; no formal CAD Training; intermittent TurboCAD user since yr. 2000 [ver6.5])
---TurboCAD: V20.2PP(57.0)[as of 3/12/15]; V19DL(54.2); V11.2Pro; Windows-7-Pro/64-bit; Intel-Core-i3 CPU; 2.27ghz; 4GB RAM; Intel HD Graphics (CPU based)