Furniture Maker V8

[Nick Hinton]

Just down loaded V8, to install on pro V16.2, and get these massages?
Has any one got any idea's, how to get this to install?


Nick

[Nick Hinton]

just tried to open turbo cad, now get these massages?
 

[Nick Hinton]

And these?
Now Turbo cad will not work?
I can not remove Furniture maker in the programs list, because it did not install properly.

[Alan C]

Can't help other than to say can you get you computer back to how it was using system restore, and what operating system are you using?

[Nick Hinton]

Hi Alan
I have done a system restore, and now get these massages?
My operating system is Vista.
with Turbo CAD pro v12.5 v15.2  v16.
V15.2 & v16 both stopped working? 

[turbotech]

Nick,

The contents of furniture maker is very large and most likely some packet was dropped during download.  Send me an e-mail directly and we will get a resolution for you. 

rfowler@imsidesign.com

[Nick Hinton]

Hi Rip
I have just sent you an email.
How can I get Turbo CAD to work again?

Nick

[Stefaan]

Hi Nick, I have the same problems with Furniture maker 8.0 as you, I did a system restore in Windows Vista and TC 16.1works again just like before the install.
Iff you do restore youre system, make sure you restore your system to a date before the install of furniture maker.

[Nick Hinton]

Hi Stefaan
I rolled back mine to far.
Rip has got  Turbo CAD working again, but the zip file has got problems, that he sent me?

[turbotech]

The problem is that Furniture Maker is to big to download.  If you have purchased furniture maker 8 and are having trouble with the download send me an e-mail and I will do my best to get this sorted out.

rfowler@imsidesign.com

[Stefaan]

Hi Rip, I try to mail you tomorrow again, my mail is been blokked by some spamprotection.

[Stefaan]

Hi Rip, I still can't mail you and always get back this message

The following message to <rfowler@imsidesign.com> was undeliverable. The reason for the problem: 5.1.0 - Unknown address error 554-'Service unavailable; Client host [mailrelay010.isp.belgacom.be] blocked by zen.spamhaus.org; http://www.spamhaus.org/query/bl?ip=91.179.11.226'

[okanagan]

I have the same problem.  Get the same error messages.
I manually uninstalled by:
1  Delete the Spinar directory.
2  search for furniture maker and delete all

There is a DLL that drives the menu addition in TC make sure that the avove removed it.

I have been tring to get a refund out of IMSI but so far no response.
I don't think their proceedure actually works.

[Nick Hinton]

Hi Rip
What very nice surprise I got this morning, a CD was delivered to me.
The program is working fine now.
Thank you very much Rip for sorting this out.
Happy New Year.

Nick

[turbotech]

If anybody is still having trouble please send me an e-mail or a personal message through the forum.

[Alan C]

Hi Rip
What very nice surprise I got this morning, a CD was delivered to me.
The program is working fine now.
Thank you very much Rip for sorting this out.
Happy New Year.

Nick

Over 6 months on and this part of the forum has been pretty quiet, which means one of two things, either hardly anyone is using Furniture Maker, or it runs so smoothly, there are no snags to talk about. Having just looked at the utube video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwb_l2Nw_iI&NR=1 which is pretty amazing really, I still wonder if I should relaunch into Furniture Maker, having tried the first version of it many years ago, or whether there are still nuances which limit the way I use Turbocad, compromising the level of freedom I am accustomed to.

Alan.

[dedmin]

Any news? I'm also interest in FurnitureMaker, but the lack of info is discouraging!

[Alan C]

Nothing to my knowledge. Neither have I upgraded from the initial offering which for me at that time was a waste of money, I think Nick has found the latest version useful though. B.R.  Alan.

[dedmin]

Let's hope Nick will give us  some working info about the new version

[dedmin]

Just browsed the developer's site and saw that there is a module for connectors - dowels, hinges and etc. Is this a part of the plugin?

[Alan C]

Seriously Dedmin, if this was any good there would be discussions galore on cabinetmaking forums across the globe. The mediocre publicity and scant in depth content on this forum reinforces my view that this must be a quirky unpolished product, please correct me somebody if I am wrong, but from what I have heard about the cutlist being 2d based for example, and that an attempt has been made to reinvent cutlist programs, when far more sophisticated and advanced systems already exist, makes me think this has been not much more than a good idea, but without the determination and investment required to make a top affordable solution. I think Sketchup and Ecabinetsystems have made quite successful alternative products, but in my experience they both have limitations, the former in that items need to be either grouped or made into assembly to avoid being merged into another object, and the latter is not a full blown CAD product. I have looked into many alternatives about a year ago. Rhino is developing furniture making capabilities with their Python scripting if I remember correctly. Solid works can probably do it but in my opinion they are overpriced and their sales/training team are unprofessional, inviting me to a furniture making seminar which turned out to be something entirely different so I left in disgust. So in summary, I think it is a big shame that Turbocad hasn't taken this further because I feel there is a need for pure CAD based furniture making applications with good bill of materials export, but we cabinetmakers won't put our money into something unless it is proved to be good and reliable, but IMSI Design expects us to be beta testers for several years until a usable version is released, like it took to version 11 to get a really good version of Turbocad. Just my opinion. There is certainly a gap int the market for us woodworkers, and Turbocad could potentially be used to fill it but they need real furniture makers to guide them to make the product we need. Feels like the evolution of mankind is standing still in this corner.

[dedmin]

Couldn't agree more! I'm in the same position and find  SketchUP a good alternative, but it's way of handling curves (or lack of real curves) is real problem when You need export to CNC. In my country - Bulgaria, all the furniture application are based on AutoCAD - slow, inflexible and expensive! Tried Rhino and love it - but it's very hard to make changes, You need scripting or Grasshopper to make parametric models and to export cutlist. Tried Alibre - to slow for interiors, no internal render. Tried SolidWorks - excellent, but too complicated with a lot of unnecessary power and too expensive. Tried SpaceClaim - good, but to mechanical. And always AutoCAD - despite my computer is getting more and more powerful, AutoCAD is getting slower and buggier! And working in 3D is very uncomfortable! So, TurboCAD - real CAD, lots of power and flexibility, good price and I like the old style interface. I'm playing with the demo now and think with the parametric symbols, scripting and custom data can make it work for my needs. One problem - there is no way to extract bounding box dimensions when doing report. And You are so right - there is a huge gap for a mid-range real CAD for furniture and woodworking! Specialized programs are not so flexible and way to expensive - we need to do a lot more than just boxes!

[Alan C]

Dedmin, thank you for your further comments. Regarding Rhino, yes grasshopper, I thought I hadn't got it right saying Python. Interesting that you find sketchup limiting, but I still feel a bit of guilt that I haven't broken through a perseverance level with it. Regarding Alibre from what I have head the limitation apart from your own comments are that it is slow to use for furniture due to the need to build using constraints being compulsory rather than just when needed, though they have made it easier in recent versions and the latest version is apparently fully 64bit compliant. Very interesting indeed that you say in Bulgaria Autocad is the norm, as that is also the case in the UK, and interesting to hear that you find it slow and buggy as that makes me feel better having taken the Turbocad decision in those early years when I was deciding which ship to board. What is so exasperating is that Turbocad is great in so many ways and I do not believe it would take a tremendous amount of effort to get it good for furniture makers. Floorplan has been an interesting deveopment over the years but it always seemed a bit complicated having to have two programs to use with floorplan print spacemaker or whatever it was called to link the two. Envisioneer seemed  a pretty good product but again, insufficient CAD and when exporting furniture in if I remember rightly the essential attribute info is not included, or the whole stl file I think it was gets imported as a single part, sorry it was so long ago details are fuzzy in my memory.

I repeat in summary, that there is a market for us real cad using cabinetmakers for a good fairly simple furniture making version which sends out a file to [my preference:] Cutlist Plus. The trouble is that the programs out there are either too structured and take away the freedoms of design or not structured enough. Perhaps what we require really needs full 64 bit to be fast enough, though I doubt it unless we want rendered moving examination views. Needs Imsi Design to get some good cabinetmakers round the table in my opinion.
B.R. Alan.

[dedmin]

I also use CutListPlus because of its integration with SketchUp, but the problem - its report is in English - how to send a bulgarian client an English proposal? I'm using SketchUP now, but there is a lack of reporting plugin - I asked a script gurus to make one, but they are more interesting in architectural kind of plugins. So, I need to learn Ruby to make my own or find another program. Making furniture is a mixing bag - we need to be fast, to work in front of the client, to make fast changes in real time, to calculate the final price in real time and to render in no time! Here the real business is in the furniture supermarket - we work with the clients in real time and if we can't make it here - the shop will be quiet!

[Alan C]

Dedmin, I presume you are aware of the cutlist ruby script by Steve Racz http://www.srww.com/blog/?p=1002
Also, Todd Peterson at Cutlist Plus seems a reasonable sort of fellow, and he would probably allow you to write a translation for Cutlist Plus. Your English is superb, and doubt much time would be involved, and Cutlistplus would surely sell more gold or platinum licences if it had a Bulgarian version.

[dedmin]

Yes, I'm using this script, had a couple conversations with the developer, but it lacks functionality I need. For instance there is no way to export banding info, swap length and width - in CutList the grain is always with the length. I have a custom made components that holds a lot of data - material, banding, oversize, price, hardware, grain direction and etc. If I export this data to a excel table - I can calculate the project in no time. This is essential here - the client wants the price now. Here is a screenshot of my basic building block - the panel. We are working with melamine faced boards, mdf or hdf. With this panel I can build any project - when i change the size it calculates the price and the sq.m of the material, the length and the price of the banding, the connectors needed, the grain direction, the oversize and I can put any info needed. Sorry, about the language

[Alan C]

Dedmin, I take my hat off to you in respect for getting so far as you have with this. It has been my ambition also to get to this level of automation, but my business is too small really and my products too varied to justify the preparation, but I do enjoy the process of automation because efficiency rocks! I just hope somebody at Imsi reads this conversation and somebody starts turning some driving wheels. There is a big readership of these posts, though I doubt if more than 25% are by woodworkers. Come in anyone else and chime in, especially if you are a professional woodworker.

[Don Cheke]

Dedmin, I take my hat off to you in respect for getting so far as you have with this. It has been my ambition also to get to this level of automation, but my business is too small really and my products too varied to justify the preparation, but I do enjoy the process of automation because efficiency rocks! I just hope somebody at Imsi reads this conversation and somebody starts turning some driving wheels. There is a big readership of these posts, though I doubt if more than 25% are by woodworkers. Come in anyone else and chime in, especially if you are a professional woodworker.

As a former commercial cabinet maker I totally agree with what you both have been discussing. Woodworking is a huge industry and I think TurboCAD would be the best product for the job if only IMSI would address the item discussed, plus a few other issues that make it inefficient in the materials application area. The current woodworking tool (layout), although better than before, has a major flaw with what it recognizes and the Report functions that are supposed to double as a BOM is horribly inefficient to say the least. If these were addressed, just think what an awesome tool cabinet makers would have. I can easily envision it.

[dedmin]

My business is also very small - that is why I'm taking this way. Just to use a panel, not full blown ready made cabinets as dynamic components. So,  I start with this panel and then copy it and change what is needed to build the final project. This is like a  brick - simple and easy. The cabinet You see was build this way - I import this panel and then copy, resize, change banding, joinery and etc. Then save this cabinet as a component for further projects. You can make all Your types of cabinets this way. With the same panel I can start any custom project - see this - the same way

[dedmin]

Dedmin, I take my hat off to you in respect for getting so far as you have with this. It has been my ambition also to get to this level of automation, but my business is too small really and my products too varied to justify the preparation, but I do enjoy the process of automation because efficiency rocks! I just hope somebody at Imsi reads this conversation and somebody starts turning some driving wheels. There is a big readership of these posts, though I doubt if more than 25% are by woodworkers. Come in anyone else and chime in, especially if you are a professional woodworker.

As a former commercial cabinet maker I totally agree with what you both have been discussing. Woodworking is a huge industry and I think TurboCAD would be the best product for the job if only IMSI would address the item discussed, plus a few other issues that make it inefficient in the materials application area. The current woodworking tool (layout), although better than before, has a major flaw with what it recognizes and the Report functions that are supposed to double as a BOM is horribly inefficient to say the least. If these were addressed, just think what an awesome tool cabinet makers would have. I can easily envision it.

Fully agree - searching for so long a suitable program for woodworking and really thing TurboCAD is the best platform for this!

[Alan C]

Dedmin, I take my hat off to you in respect for getting so far as you have with this. It has been my ambition also to get to this level of automation, but my business is too small really and my products too varied to justify the preparation, but I do enjoy the process of automation because efficiency rocks! I just hope somebody at Imsi reads this conversation and somebody starts turning some driving wheels. There is a big readership of these posts, though I doubt if more than 25% are by woodworkers. Come in anyone else and chime in, especially if you are a professional woodworker.

As a former commercial cabinet maker I totally agree with what you both have been discussing. Woodworking is a huge industry and I think TurboCAD would be the best product for the job if only IMSI would address the item discussed, plus a few other issues that make it inefficient in the materials application area. The current woodworking tool (layout), although better than before, has a major flaw with what it recognizes and the Report functions that are supposed to double as a BOM is horribly inefficient to say the least. If these were addressed, just think what an awesome tool cabinet makers would have. I can easily envision it.

Hi Don Cheke,

Great to have your support as you are one of the most respected individuals in the Turbocad community, and justifiably so! What can we do to get Imsi Design to sit up and take notice? I thought Turbocad was being reborn when Imsi Design took over from IMSI. Is it just my imagination or has the management run out of puff? I acknowledge that we woodworkers are only a proportion of the Turbocad user community, but not that small surely, and potentially, quite a size I think? In the past I think CAD program companies have been held back by the woodworking industry being stuck in 2d, but I think that mentality is on the change.
Kind regards, Alan.

[Alan C]

I should add, the future could be TC versus Google Sketchup rather than TC versus Autocad. I seriously think Google is a force to be reckoned with but they are certainly not perfect. For example I switched to them to retrieve my emails from my internet host, so as to be cloud based to manage from phone or pc, but they are so slow to send to my inbox sometimes I am thinking of going back to Thunderbird. I am now losing faith in Google, it is getting complacent I think, come on Imsi Design, sieze the opportunity in the CAD arena!

[dedmin]

And my experience is that people like us are huge majority - small shops trying to switch from 2D to 3D. searching for affordable 3D CAD software, buying their first CNC and looking for automation. Wake Up  Imsi!

[dedmin]

I should add, the future could be TC versus Google Sketchup rather than TC versus Autocad. I seriously think Google is a force to be reckoned with but they are certainly not perfect. For example I switched to them to retrieve my emails from my internet host, so as to be cloud based to manage from phone or pc, but they are so slow to send to my inbox sometimes I am thinking of going back to Thunderbird. I am now losing faith in Google, it is getting complacent I think, come on Imsi Design, sieze the opportunity in the CAD arena!

Alan, take a look -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z5W350pLByA&feature=player_embedded
http://www.sketchdata.com/

[dedmin]

I send an e-mail to the developers of the Furniture Maker, and got a surprise - there is a new version - TurboCAD Furniture Maker v9 !!!

http://www.turbocad.com/TurboCAD/TurboCADWindows/Plugins/FurnitureMakerv9/KeyFeatures/tabid/1411/Default.aspx

[WillR]

I send an e-mail to the developers of the Furniture Maker, and got a surprise - there is a new version - TurboCAD Furniture Maker v9 !!!

http://www.turbocad.com/TurboCAD/TurboCADWindows/Plugins/FurnitureMakerv9/KeyFeatures/tabid/1411/Default.aspx

It looks like Version 9 could address a lot of my earlier concerns. I note that labels are available etc.

I have standardized on System 32 -- gave up on architectural units so I will settle for pure metric etc...

Next time there is a "deal" offered I guess I will bite! 

[Wooddan]

Hi guys,

This has turned into a very good discussion.  I build cabinets part time.  I got into TurboCAD in order to design the cabinets, and then use that info to create the construction info.  I too had considered Furniture Maker for creating cutlists, and panel optimizing, however I have doubts about it's functionality. 

My opinion on why there is very little discussion about this on the cabinetmaking forums is that most cabinetmakers use different design software alltogether.  I have never seen TurboCAD mentioned or advertised in any cabinet makers or woodworking magazines or discussions.  The pro's use programs such as http://www.cabinetpro.com, http://www.microvellum.com/cabinetmaker/, http://www.kcdsoftware.com, http://www.cabinetvision.com  Some shops use AutoCAD.  Some shops even still do their work with graphite, rulers and paper.  I've even seen Chief Architect advertised for cabinetmaking.

From what I've gathered, some of these programs are Autocad based drag-n-drop type of programs that can be easily modified through parameters.  They are all 3D capable and usually have the ability to do cutlists, panel optimization (layouts), even label printing, as well as numerous material reports. Some of the programs have the ability to add G-Code writing for CNC operations.  I don't know how much real CAD these things can do though.  I suspect it would be pretty limited.  I also believe these programs are a little pricey, and I am sure have a fair amount of learning curve to them.

I have also seen that SketchUp is really becoming popular in the world of woodworking design.  I have briefly tried SketchUp and found it to be more involved than what I can do with T-CAD.  Maybe that's just my lack of skill with SketchUp. 

I love the power and flexibility of T-CAD (which is way more than my skills for sure).  I think it by far outperforms SketchUp and with some tweaking, and integration with cutlist plus, can compete favorably with some of the cabinetmaking programs. I agree with Don, this is a rather large industry, and IMSI could be missing out on a good opportunity. Not only with the pro's, but also the hobbyists.  I think that would be an excellent area for a marketing campaign.  I think that IMSI could do a cabinetmaking/woodworking version kind of similar to the architectural version.  Don, you are right, that would be awesome. 

BTW  dedmin, your drawing looks amazing.

The YouTube links are right on.  That's the sort of thing I am looking for.  Now we just need to do the same thing in TurboCAD.

Dan

P.S.  I realize we are probably getting off of the original subject, should we start a new thread?  Maybe in the wish list?

[Alan C]

Hi everyone, sorry I'm a bit late coming back to this thread, great to see the continued activity. Those sketchup utube videos look interesting. I have followed some of Joseph Zeh's tutorials on furniture design with Sketchup http://www.srww.com/google-sketchup.htm but I thought it would be at least as quick in Turbocad, however the furniture warehouse libraries in the Sketchup depositaries throw extra light on the advantages. I have also been looking at alternatives to microsoft windows as a basis for operating system, and for Linux, [Ubuntu's latest version is pretty awesome] the best offering seems to be Varicad, which again has come a long way since I last looked 4 years ago. I do think that Linux is the way forward, apparently Sketchup is working on Linux through the Wine intermediary, but as far as I know only a few past versions of Turbocad have worked with Wine. I am keeping Ubuntu on one of my laptops, it is surprising just how well it integrates with Windows XP as guest now running on Virtual box version 4 within Ubuntu as host. Anyone who gave up with Linux and virtual box in the previous versions should consider again now that Virtualbox [now owned by Oracle] fully supports USB and seamless integration of mouse operations now [through the new Virtualbox extension pack] with Ubuntu, running on the most advanced file system there is [ext4] and can be backed up to image using Clonezilla. We are getting very close to being able to finally give Microsoft the boot, [no love lost for their unneccessarily vulnerable and limiting systems] and it is therefore important that IMSI ensures that they consider Wine and even native Linux distros in their future plans. Sorry for the diversion, but I think it is relevant when making long term plans for the future to prepare the ground for the track in the right direction. For now, Virtualbox is a great way of phasing MS Windows out of our lives gracefully IMHO. I haven't tested it for long though so test before you commit fully. Regards, Alan.

[smcmiller@cfl.rr.com]

I just saw this post, but I wouldn't recommend buying furniture maker if you have TC17.  I have TC 17 Pro Platinum, and purchased TCFM version 8 in October 2010.  I immediately had problems with the software not loading the symbols.  I tried to muddle through the documentation, but since it doesn't apply to TC 17 none of what it said made any sense.  I opened a trouble ticket with IMSI on Nov 3 2010, and have yet to receive a response.  I also tried to send email to R. Fowler from the forum, but his email gets kicked back.  I have been buying Turbocad for 10 years, but at this point I am about fed up with IMSI, and unless I get some support don't think  Iwill buy anymore software from them.

[Alan C]

That's a shame. The old IMSI company used to behave like that. I thought there had been improvement since IMSI Design took over?

[WillR]

There is now a Version 10. Does anybody have any feedback?

Does it work with Version 18 Turbocad? If so I might take a look.

OOPS: Version 10

[Alan C]

New version, really? Perhaps there will be some promotion about it soon. It beggars belief that a company can be so unconcerned about its service and product that they leave these recent comments and observations unchallenged and dealt with! There needs to be some pride and turn around in attitude before it's even likely to work properly in my humble opinion. If things begin to work as they should I am sure there will be excitement that we will even hear about outside of the Turbocad Community so I think I will not be wasting time on this but still hope that one day we will enjoy a product either from IMSI or elsewhere that will offer an economical and effective solution for furniture makers which is better than Google Sketchup. Sorry that was rather a long sentence!

[WillR]

Version 10 -- here...
http://www.turbocad.com/TurboCAD/TurboCADWindows/Plugins/FurnitureMakerv9/KeyFeatures/tabid/1411/Default.aspx

It would be Nice if it were version 18 compatible... and does say versions 15 - 18...

Anybody want to risk $200USD to test it? 

AT $100 I would risk it -- $200 is where I want to know it works as it's my personal funds -- not a company with cash flow buying it.

Any Feedback?

[Alan C]

Will, I would say don't touch it without a free trial. Less likely to be trouble free than more likely. You are bound to find yourself a paying beta tester. This is not cynicism, but observation of history.

[Alan C]

I see there are some alternatives to Sketchup and Microvelum popping up for the woodworker now, namely Polyboard, and a plugin which works with Autodesk Inventor. But I suspect these are all expensive, and for one man designer-maker setups, we do still need Imsi Design to persevere with an affordable product.

[Fer2006]

I once tried Sketchup, did not like it, so attached to my TC software, on simple matters I use Excel, Cutlist Gold, and TC, big jobs Cabinet Vision Solid, but I do agree with you guys, IMSI should concentrate and do more research on customer needs, it is fine to earn money for a better way of life,  but IMSI is not paying attentions to what customers said, or seems otherwise, I also own a Hardware store and Lumber Yard, I always do my best to keep my customers happy, they bring food to my table and the pay the school bills, so IMSI should do their homework, when people get tired of bad service, no matter how bad we feel sometimes, we switch, .... still I do have hopes the this Co. iwll finally listen to all woodworkers, simple people that do not have the resources to buy very expensive software, but with a great heart....
God bless... happy weekend